ariestess: ebooks panelists, on deck!
ariestess: ebooks panelists, please change your font to bold red [like mine]. Everyone else, please use black text…
quietheartedfsc: Welcome to ebooks
quietheartedfsc: WE’ve had some issues with this morning with panelists not having internet access suddenly
ariestess: First the ground rules. You MUST raise your hand for questions. The mods [those of us with an @ in front of our names] will keep track of the questions for everyone.
ariestess: I hate to think what kind of message teh universe is sending us by the issues with panelists and connectivity.
docwho2100: Tech is a blessed curse
quietheartedfsc: We’re going to get a bit creative here to compensate
ariestess: And being creative is what we do best!
quietheartedfsc: So let’s talk about ebooks themselves.
quietheartedfsc: There’s a lot of good ones coming out.
quietheartedfsc: more and more folks are switching to ebooks as opposed to paper copies
quietheartedfsc: so tell us what you’re reading right now
ariestess: I have a lot of ebooks saved on my hard drive for when I get an e-reader.
olli01a: I read the Under the Gun series by Lori L. lake
docwho2100: I am reading a few postapocalyptic novels for story research, Shiva’s Mother by Andrea Phillips and a few on transmedia
quietheartedfsc: do you find you download more than used to…
quietheartedfsc: jae told us yesterday she has one coming out in November
ariestess: If my iPod had more space [ie. not as much music] & I knew I could dl ebooks from Amazon on it, I’d be reading on my iPod more.
quietheartedfsc: and Gun Brooke just released a new one
docwho2100: @Ari – I do more and more reading on my mobile device or on my laptop than using an ereader
ariestess: @doc :: I"m always doing other things on my computer, so don’t think to read. Though maybe I should start doing that with the netbook…
quietheartedfsc: I got a Kindle for christmas so it’s my new main companion
quietheartedfsc: once I figured out I could email it .docs, I went nuts loading it with fanfic..*G*
AlexReading: easier on the eyes reading off ebook devices than mobile or netbooks.
ariestess: LOL @ QH
Kaqlittle: I download my books to my iPhone and iPad
ariestess: @alex :: I bet it is. I just don’t have the money for an ereader, and no one in my family would buy such a thing for a gift for me.
olli01a: I read in my tablet and have no problems
quietheartedfsc: aj, blame D…she gave it to me
Alsike: I was traveling a lot this summer, but I realized AO3 lets you download fic as ebooks, so I could have fic w/o internet.
ariestess: @QH :: LOL! I’ll do that!
quietheartedfsc: mobi downloads to crackberries and such as well
docwho2100: I also started doing more as services have come out that send me links – for the postapocalyptic, the service sends me everyday any ebook tagged as postapocalyptic that is free from amazon
docwho2100: I also follow twitter accounts out there that are nothing but ebook lists
AlexReading: @AJ I waited a long time to get a backlit eink, so thats saving over time.
ariestess: I have a "cheap" phone w/o internet, so no ebooks there.
ariestess: @alex :: that would require having a job that pays more than I’m getting from doing childcare for my nephew
quietheartedfsc: I carried around fanfic and ebooks on my crackberry all the time…waiting in lines was a snap after that.
quietheartedfsc: still working out how to do that on the "droid from hell"
olli01a: I like it to have my whole library with me and can chose wich book to read
Kaqlittle: I dislike droid. sometimes so complicated
quietheartedfsc: Kaq, I’m agreeing…but i’ve only had it a month and I hated the crackberry for 2 months when I first got it
olli01a: I use my iPad as ebook reader works very well
quietheartedfsc: Do you think that more archives should go to ebook formats? Offer the stories there for download?
shesgottaread: @QH: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_Android_e-book_reader_software
Kaqlittle: I disliked apple when I had a blackberry but them I got the iPhone and love it.
shesgottaread: although I think there are a couple missing from that list
AlexReading: iPad seems to be the champion device, I got told just to get one, and stop hunting for others lol
Kaqlittle: yes. I love ebooks
docwho2100: thank you @sgr for the link
ariestess: @QH :: I’ve considered the ebook options for SSP, but don’t know how feasible it is.
quietheartedfsc: ty sgr…
docwho2100: and it looks like Michelle has a question?
michelle_2011: I use a Kindle app on my PC. Is there a place to find websites with ebooks?
Kaqlittle: I use Bella Books
AlexReading: @AJ, as in making ebooks out of the stories? I gv up on my sites.
olli01a: @michelle_2011: bean books offers DRM free ebooks
ariestess: @alex :: Yes, that’s what I mean.
quietheartedfsc: sgr, you had a question?
Library_Rio: for Xena fic, there is the AusXIP’s Rocket EBook Corner, PDA Fiction and eBooks by Lida
shesgottaread: My question is how many of ya’ll are using Calibre and the Fanfiction Downloader plugin for creating/reading fanfic?
shesgottaread: or just using Calibre for ebooks purchased?
AlexReading: I do. need them for my ebook sites.
Library_Rio: I use Calibre and Sigil for creating ebooks for the Xena Library
Library_Rio: I hadn’t heard of the Fanfictin Downloader plugin before
quietheartedfsc: is there even a reader for Rocket ebooks anymore?
ariestess: When I start downloading fanfic, I’ll probably use Calibre. Or the AO3 option.
AlexReading: the plug-in is nifty to get chapters.
docwho2100: http://calibre-ebook.com/ is the basic site
AlexReading: Rocket ebooks died a couple of yrs ago.
olli01a: I use Calibre and the jutoh epublishing software to convert fanfiction into ebooks to sync with my iPad
quietheartedfsc: that’s what I’ve found Alex, and so far no luck in converting them to readable coding
AlexReading: or if Calibre is too much, skip them all and use www.flagfic.com/
AlexReading: works for ff.net stuff and a few other major achives.
AlexReading: @QH, I had to manually recode most of the books.
quietheartedfsc: @ Alex, ty…if I had again enough and time…*G*
quietheartedfsc: some of the archivists have talked about converting to offering ebooks as well, but it’s a huge undertaking.
ariestess: @QH :: I’ve considered that, but you’re right, it’s a HUGE undertaking to consider.
AlexReading: @QH, it’s a thankless task, gave up.
quietheartedfsc: but don’t you think a lot of what we do is a "thankless task"
quietheartedfsc: what the femslash world needs is more minions…lol
ariestess: @QH :: good point!
Shatterpath: ah lot of waht y’all do IS a thankless task
Shatterpath: and we thank you for it
AlexReading: lol. not quite so much
docwho2100: And last year more ebooks were bought that physical books from some vendors
quietheartedfsc: and there’s more ways to buy them than ever
ariestess: I have a minion. She just doesn’t remember how to do most ofthe stuff I need her to do.
Shatterpath: ‘fraid so
quietheartedfsc: but she’s a good doggie otherwise
quietheartedfsc: I wouldn’t even want to begin to be an archivist….that’s enormous…
docwho2100: Alex has a question
quietheartedfsc: go ahead Alex
ariestess: Take it away, Alex!
ariestess: @QH :: I’m working on ways to get better at my archiving. I’m half-wondering if our discussion last night about WP wouldn’t help.
AlexReading: yes, thank u doc. With majpr publishers going ebooks, how many bought paperback then got ebooks copies after.
olli01a: I do
quietheartedfsc: I only buy the paperback if the ebook isn’t available, which strangely does still happen now and then.
AlexReading: I refused to get Harry Potter in paperback.
ariestess: @alex :: Why refusing with HP? *is curious*
docwho2100: Well, I am finding, I am migrating more to them by choice from the getgo, rather than double purchase, although it is oddly like DVD to digital/streaming migration that is happening now as well
quietheartedfsc: holding books can be physically uncomfortable for me, so I’m not the best means of judging on that one.
docwho2100: Also, some publishers now offer perks with the ebook and other digital connections through the book
AlexReading: I figured sooner or later the lady is gonna epublish, and she kept writing…
olli01a: I simply like having all my books with me every time
docwho2100: I’ve been actually "buying" a lot of my books through Kickstarter (a whole other topic) – but most of those authors now offer the choice as a given, and some only offer ebook
AlexReading: @doc, at one pt in time, there were discussion of multi-media ebooks…
quietheartedfsc: I ahve about 60ft of wall space with floor to ceiling books…ebooks are a necessity.
ariestess: There are certain books that I will always have a hard copy of. But a lot of the others I’d gladly buy again in ebook format to have them all together in an easier to carry format
docwho2100: @Alex – they are still there – although most have very limited resources because people are not "upgrading" the tech, so the engagement tends to be linking to other resources, maybe some music, etc
quietheartedfsc: text books I buy in paper copy because I find them easier to flip, skim and research…but pleasure reading is all ebook now
AlexReading: but really with removable storage, do we need to carry 36GB worth of ebooks.
docwho2100: @Alex – that is actally the toe dip into the next big "revolution" coming down the media pike – cloud based services
ariestess: 36GB? *stares*
docwho2100: MOre and more people do not own dvds
AlexReading: the size of the micro-SD card on my mobile, and my math is bad lol
docwho2100: They would rather stream it than own it
docwho2100: especially the under 30 demographics
quietheartedfsc: if it streams…*hates buffering*
olli01a: Movies probably. ebooks no!
olli01a: I want to own my ebooks
docwho2100: How many times do most people "reread" a book?
quietheartedfsc: let me ask a little theoretical question here
ariestess: I don’t mind streaming stuff, but I’d rather just own the DVD.
quietheartedfsc: for me, dozens of times, doc
quietheartedfsc: if I like it I read and read again.
ariestess: @doc :: Depending on the book, more times than I can count.
AlexReading: me too, own is good. cloud get deleted ala amazon!
ariestess: @QH :: What’s your theoretical question?
psychotic-cat17: I actually reread books more often now that I have ebooks than I did when they were in hardcopy
olli01a: I re-read books i like a lot
quietheartedfsc: ok…you buy a paperback, read it, love it and lend it to a friend…we’ve all done it for years.
olli01a: @psychotic: exactly
quietheartedfsc: so why is it considered piracy to do the same with an ebook?
olli01a: I don’t know
AlexReading: eh, I got someone wanted to pirate my site…
ariestess: I wish I had an answer to that question, QH.
docwho2100: because lending was piracy too
docwho2100: that’s a cultural POV not a legal one ; )
ariestess: Because it’s easier to keep track of the piracy online?
Kaqlittle: I think that with the Internet things get complicated
quietheartedfsc: ah, when was the last time you saw a print author yelling piracy at a lending library?
docwho2100: Copyright is sooo cutthroat these days as media engagement and access is changing
docwho2100: when some first started, they did not like it
docwho2100: but over time, they realized more eyes often means better returns
AlexReading: ridculous I can get paperbk sent from US to Aus, but not ebooks!!
docwho2100: also, digital travels further than physical lending
AlexReading: not like I am not paying for them *rolleyes*
quietheartedfsc: My point is I think it’s all become a bit overblown…
Kaqlittle: with a library u loan things out to a number of people but someone bought the book in the first place. the Internet is different. u get the book… bought or otherwise and then put it on a website and hundreds of thousands of people can get it for free.
quietheartedfsc: Now I may change my mind when I get to be a pub’d writer, but I’m doubting it.
olli01a: the publishers can not control where a hradcopy goes after it left their warehouse. A digital file can be traced
AlexReading: @kaqlittle not everyone will do that… who can’t photocopy a book? or scan?
Kaqlittle: u can. but it does take alot of time and effort
quietheartedfsc: anyone own any paperbacks that already had the cover torn off when they got them?
ariestess: I don’t, but Shatterpath does, as she got them when she worked at a bookstore.
quietheartedfsc: those are considered pirated copies
shaych03: yeah. got at yard sales/thrift stores
shesgottaread: not anymore, but back in 70s, yes
AlexReading: garage sale?
Kaqlittle: it’s easier to pirate audio books
docwho2100: If you want more worms, what about used book sales : )
quietheartedfsc: bookstores tore the covers off and sent them back for credit to distributors..the books were then supposed to be trashed…
AlexReading: used book booksstores
shaych03: yeah – can’t sell a used digital file as easily as you can a physical book
docwho2100: What is I want to seel my ereader with my library on it to someone
quietheartedfsc: bad, doc…the pirating police will get ya
AlexReading: errrr doc.
AlexReading: lets quit with the P! might get shut down lol
olli01a: as long as the books are DRM free. And you can legally buy DRM free books
quietheartedfsc: it’s all become a huge gray area…
quietheartedfsc: the internet has blurred the boundaries on so many things
olli01a: sooner or later the DRM for ebooks will come to an end like with digital music
ariestess: 15 minute warning to the end of the panel.
AlexReading: not after facebook. there are still boundries?
shesgottaread: in the meantime, Adobe’s raking in huge $$ for their DRM service/software.
shaych03: or they’ll go the way some game companies are – all ebooks stored in the cloud, accessable only when you access the cloud
docwho2100: Media companies are trying to preserve the boundaries
quietheartedfsc: Alex, at this point, I honestly thing that sometimes the boundaries only exist in someones head for a second at a time.
docwho2100: And some places, like Apple just got "smacked" regarding ebooks
ariestess: Media companies need to realize that a lot of their business models are outdated.
docwho2100: yes @ari, the so
quietheartedfsc: when has business ever been on the forefront of technology if that wasn’t they way they made their money in the first place.
ariestess: Good point, QH.
shesgottaread: and the pubs need to get the public (and themselves) to understand that Amazon is bad for the industry
AlexReading: .yap QH
shaych03: it’s not their place to be on the forefront, it’s their place to make money for shareholders
Kaqlittle: why is amazon bad?
docwho2100: which is where self publishing comes into play, if you have time and resources
shesgottaread: but if they aren’t toward the front, sticking to old models, the shareholders won’t have anything after a while
ariestess: Very true, SGR
docwho2100: I am not sure what sgr was referencing, but I know many authors who have to sign agreements to let Amazon "set" their ebook prices, to some degree
quietheartedfsc: but by the time the shareholders realize, they rush to catch up to last year…lol
shesgottaread: when Amazon is willing to take losses, undercutting what even the publishers can sell for, then pubs can’t meet it,
shaych03: they’ll change only when it looks like they’re about to drown and die
docwho2100: in exchange they get the Amazon marketing powerhouse, sort of…
shesgottaread: Amazon & B&N and Apple, have terms: can’t sell for less anywhere else
quietheartedfsc: when it’s the only game in town…game owner rules
shesgottaread: so if Amazon cuts the price, then the others have to have the price cut as well
AlexReading: which actually translate good for us readers, but bad for authors.
ariestess: Very true.
shesgottaread: bad for authors, bad for publishers, eventually bad for readers when Amazon becomes the only game in town
AlexReading: so newbie authors, think before signing.
docwho2100: Amazon, for instance, decided to put this one author’s book on their "free deal" of the day, cutting the price to zero. They explained that it gave the author all these eyes, but realize, the author made no money for those 5000+ eyes but Amazon still made out
AlexReading: apart from the fact I ahve to buy a newer gadget every now and then from amazon…
ariestess: Oh, I hadn’t thought about that, doc. And that’s how I got a bunch of the ebooks on my computer right now.
shaych03: how did amazon make out? it was free. both amazon and the author got the benefit of the "eyes"
shesgottaread: and Amazon doesn’t share w/authors or pubs any demographics about their sales
docwho2100: Amazon got money from ads on those pages
ariestess: Crossovers panel starts in 5 minutes.
docwho2100: the author got 5000 people who now do not need to buy the book
AlexReading: and readers well, they might buy other books, or those in a series.
shaych03: but of those 5000, how many would have bought it to begin with, and how many might then go on to buy a sequel or another by the same author?
shesgottaread: of your free books from Amazon, B&N, etc, how many have you actually read? I’ve got 700+ but only read 3
AlexReading: oh, u never know. it’s addictive.
docwho2100: That is the hope
docwho2100: as long as the author writes more
shaych03: i see those "free" book offers all the time for kindle and nook – there is rarely something i would notice to begin with, but for free, i peruse and might download
docwho2100: and yes, I like to store free stuff for later
shesgottaread: most of mine free are busines/tech though, so perhaps that’s diff
AlexReading: bec. u just need to read the rest of the R&I!
AlexReading: lol @doc.
docwho2100: An ebook hoarder
olli01a: even with free ebooks I read an excerpt first before I decide to download or not
ariestess: Thank you to all of the panelists and attendees for making this such a great panel!